“If you can’t think outside the box, you’re not going to win because everyone’s always going to have more money than you. Everyone’s always going to have more resources than you. More staff, more time. Other people have started before you. If you don’t think outside the box, it’s going to be hard to win.”
Check out Neil Patel’s interview where he goes over tips on how to go from a Novice to Expert in Digital Marketing.
0:00 Intro
1:01 Work-life balance for a Digital Marketer
3:12 The best Digital Marketers
3:50 The key to becoming the best Digital Marketer
4:47 How to be a Digital Marketer when you’re lacking communication skills
7:07 Dealing with the uncertainty of Digital Marketing
8:52 3 Tips for D2C Brands
12:14 Tools for Omnichannel Marketing
13:53 A Digital Marketer’s mantra
15:08 Specialize vs. Jack of All Trades
17:20 Delegation Tips
19:22 Digital Marketing Global Trends
20:47 Digital Marketing Resources
22:04 Lifecycle of a Digital Marketer
23:27 3 Tips for Hiring
25:31 Neil’s Favorite Food
26:23 Personal & Professional Values
27:59 Screen Time
29:02 How to grow your personal brand
RESOURCES & LINKS:
____________________________________________
Ubersuggest:
AnswerThePublic:
MailChimp:
Google Search Console:
Buffer:
Hootsuite:
Sprout Social:
HubSpot:
Backlinko Blog:
Search Engine Land:
Moz Blog:
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I think the mistake people make, forget this concept of work-life balance. I know a lot of people have a work-life balance, when their kids are there and they want to play with them, they just turn on the TV. I think of life as whatever you do, put in 110%.
I found that the people who make the best digital marketers are the ones who tend to be very creative. The ones who think outside the box. Just because you’re familiar with the digital landscape or how things work. If you can’t think outside the box, you’re not going to win.
You need to communicate well for any profession. It doesn’t matter if it’s digital or not digital, but the beautiful part about communication is as much easier to fix in creativity. So don’t go to sleep every night until all your emails are answered.
Now in your D2C brand, you’re not going to get someone to purchase hundreds of times like Amazon. But you can get them to purchase three times, four times. And it drastically changes your economics on your marketing and your ROI.
When things are going really well for you, there’s always someone else out there who has it better than you. When things are going really bad for you, there’s always someone out there who has it much worse than you. Now on both ends, it’s very important because what happens is when things start going well, people get too excited, they get caught up in the emotions and they lift their foot off the gas pedal and they don’t think as clearly.
It’s better to be a master of one than it is to be a jack of all trades. Because right now, when marketing people are hiring people who can specialize. So even though a company knows that you need omnichannel, they’re going to hire people to end up focusing on each and every single channel individually as they scale up and grow because that’s how you get the best results.
Delegation is super important. If you don’t delegate, eventually you won’t be able to scale. When you delegate, you want to delegate to people who are better than you at that specific task. If you’re not delegating to people who are better than you, then you’re not doing the best job when it comes to hiring. See, if you had to teach someone how to do the job, you’re hiring the wrong people.
I continually read blogs from Backlinko to Search Engine Land to Moz. I learned more actually by studying other players within my industry and other players outside of my industry that are doing unique marketing tactics.
I’ll always treat other people with respect. Doesn’t matter. Personal, or professional, if you’re not treating people with respect, doesn’t matter who they are, what color their skin is if they’re male, female, or whatever gender they may be. Or you know, you just got to treat people with respect. It’s, you know, it’s a shitty thing to treat other people crappy. You wouldn’t want that to happen to you.
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– If you can't think outside the box, You're not going to win Because everyone's always going
to have more money than you. Everyone's always going to
have more resources than you. More staff, more time. Other people have started before you. If you don't think outside the box, It's going to be hard to win. – And what time do you wake up now, Neil, After that, you're taking
care of your children too. So I think earlier you
said, 6AM in the morning. So what's the time today. – Roughly? Around 5:30
is when they wake up. – That's nice. And the first thing is, any
information that you practice, Any gratitude journal? – Nope.
– Nothing like that. That's, I know what you do. You keep your laptop next to you And the first thing that you do is You wake up with your laptop. Yes? – Yep. – Nice. I like that. That's Neil, ladies and gentlemen, Who is equally addicted as
me to his phone and laptop. So let's have some fun
conversation with him today. Okay, Neil, first question to
you today, work-life balance. A digital marketing
person has this challenge. Do you have something to say? – Yeah, digital marketer, it's
not just digital marketers. Everyone has a work-life balance. If you truly love what you're doing And you want to do well at it, Because if you want to do well at it, you
Got to put in tons of time
and energy and effort into it. So you're not going to
have the work-life balance That you want, especially
at the beginning. See, later on in your career, Sure, you can create more
of a work-life balance, But it is very hard to do. When you're starting off and
you want to climb to the top, Whether it is as an entrepreneur Or whether it is in profession, Working for another company. And even later in your career, Sure, you can create more of a balance, But in many cases, You'll find that you're
still working a lot of hours. And you know, You may not have the balance
that some of your friends have. It's the sacrifice of trying
to do well in any profession. It's not what people want
to hear, but it's the truth. – Cool. So trying to say work is life. – Work is life. And yes, You need to create time for your family And other things in life. But I think the mistake people make, Forget this concept of work-life balance. I know a lot of people
have work-life balance, When their kids are there and
they want to play with them, They just turn on the TV. I think of life as whatever
you do, put in 110%. So when you spend time with your kids, Make it count. When you are hanging
out with your friends, Make it count, pay attention, Really be there for them. When you're working, again, make it count.
And I think that's the
mistake people have is, They think work-life
balance is all about putting In hours into different buckets. But when they put in these
hours into different buckets, They're not really
making those hours count And they're very inefficient And they're not getting
much value out of that time. – Wow. I totally agree to what you just said, That when you're beginning, When you're beginning your career, There's no work-life balance And you need to make those sacrifices So that you can have enough
work-life balance as with time. So that's very good thought up there. Neil. There is a, I strongly believe that people
who are digitally addicted, They make good digital
marketers. How true is that fact? – Not necessarily. I found that the people Who make the best digital
marketers are the ones Who tend to be very creative. The ones who think outside the box. Just because you're familiar
with the digital landscape Or how things work. If you can't think outside the box, You're not going to win. Because everyone's always going
to have more money than you. Everyone's always going to
have more resources than you, More staff, more time. Other people have started before you. If you don't think outside the box, It's going to be hard to
win. It's that simple. – So creativity is the key
To become a good digital marketer? – Yes. – And how can someone learn creativity? – That, I don't know. I just think, you know, I honestly don't have the answer to that. I think for a lot of people
it's in them or it's not, You know, it's just like how
do you teach that little kid, "Hey, you want to go buy this bicycle? You need to make money. Go
create lemonade and sell it." You know, to all your neighbors. That kind of stuff is
hard to teach, you know, It is just like some
people have it in them, Some people don't. What I found that can
help spur some creativity, It doesn't mean you're
naturally going to be creative, Is to read. Look at examples of what
other people are doing. Study competitors, study
people in different industries. Because it'll give you ideas in marketing And you can take some of
the concepts that work For other people in different industries And apply it to yours. – That's nice. Let's say, Neil, if someone
is good at communication, Is not good at communication. All right? Which stream of digital do you recommend? Because a lot of people Who wants to become
digital marketers in India, They don't really have
good communication skills. And I believe along with creativity That you have added right now, Communication is equally important. Now let's say they're not
good at communication.
Which streams of digital do you think They should be looking into? – None. You need to communicate
well for any profession. It doesn't matter if it's
digital or not digital, But the beautiful part about
communication is as much easier To fix in creativity. So don't go to sleep every night Until all your emails are answered. Put Slack, Skype, text
messaging, et cetera, All on your phone, WhatsApp. So when people message you,
have the notifications, Make time to respond
within 5, 10, 15 minutes, 30 at the latest or hour at the latest If you're in a meeting. But just get into habit that
you need to check your messages And respond each and every single day. If you still struggle with that, Then what I recommend doing is Within your calendar, Block off 10 minutes out
of every single hour, Just to communicate with people. So if you start practicing
some of these things, You can get better at communicating. That's really easy to fix.
Creativity is much harder, But communication, it can be fixed. And then you can, in theory, Do any form of digital
marketing or anything. – Awesome. So when I meant communication, I loved your understanding
of communication, But when I meant communication here, I meant a lot of people have poor English, They're not really good at that, And that's where the lack is.
For a lot of people who wanting
to become digital marketers, People who don't have great
English communication skills. What do you recommend to
them? That's my question. – Focus on the language that you know. So in India, there's a lot
of different dialects, right? But a lot of people know Hindi. Hindi's a great language to market in. Who says you have to market in English? A lot of people in this world speak Hindi. So figure out the languages
that you are proficient at And you could do any
form of digital marketing Within there and carve your niche. Because people will want marketers Who specialize in specific languages. Marketing is global. It's not, "Hey, we just
market in English." Majority of the world
does not speak English. – Right. Okay. Neil, There's always an uncertainty
in this world right now With respect to the changes
that digital world brings to us. How does one deal with the uncertainty, Like right from the
uncertainty of algorithms, Be it search algorithms,
be it Instagram algorithms, There's always an uncertainty. How do you deal with that And what is your tip for people On dealing with these uncertainties? – Yeah, so it's funny, Someone actually asked me this yesterday And I was talking about
my favorite, you know, Marketing channel and I told them, And they're like, "Oh, is it SCM?" I'm like, "No, my favorite
marketing channel is
Omnichannel marketing." And they're like, "Which
one is omnichannel?" I'm like, "It's all of them." See what I've learned over the
years is, algorithms change. Sometimes they benefit you, But majority of the times
they don't favor you. And you can't control if
Instagram's going to change Your algorithm or Facebook
or Google or YouTube Or any other platform out there. But what you can do is, Use each and every
single platform out there And use it to your advantage. If the algorithm changes
and it doesn't work as well, Well, use it to as much as it works. If you are making, you know, A hundred thousand
dollars in revenue a month From one channel, but it went down to 50, 50 is better than nothing. Try to adapt, try to fix it
and try to get it back up. But accept it for what it is. You know, even though
you're trying to adapt And take the approach that
channels are going to change, It's going to be harder for you, But you need to keep adding
more and more channels And you're not going to make
the majority of your revenue From one of them, but
every little bit adds up. You got to chip away at it. – Wow. This is a really cool thought up there. Neil, right now in India, D2C market is fairly booming up big time. After Covid, a lot of
brands have started stepping Into D2C, direct to
consumers and that's booming And a very interesting arena to be in.
Let's say, if at this point of time, You have to give them three
strong strategic advice Because considering today, You have to give them three
strong strategy advice To all the D2C brands, what would that be? – So number one is take
multiple payment options. So for example, In India, I believe COD is
still really popular, right? Cash on delivery. – Yes, it is. – But have multiple payment options. When you take multiple payment options. For example, when we saw in India, We also had PayPal, We saw a roughly 18% increase in revenue. So by adding multiple payment options, You quickly see more revenue. The second one is, obsess
about your product. See, in D2C, Everyone believes that
the way you make money is Influencer marketing and SEO and email And all this kind of stuff. And that's true. But the way you build a massive Commerce company is
word of mouth marketing. The only way you're going to
get word of mouth marketing is If your products are really amazing. So when people give you
critiques or feedback saying, They don't like this about your pocket, They want that change. If it's valid, don't take it offensive. Change it, fix it, make it better. And in the long run, that'll
cause more referrals, right? Natural referrals of people just saying,
"Hey, we need to recommend
X, Y, and Z product From Sarah Vernel or whatever it may be." And the third thing that you need to do is It's all about the follow up. See, everyone optimizes
D2C for the first sale, But they don't optimize
for the repeat purchases. If you look at Flipkart,
you look at Amazon, You look at all the
players that are jumping Into the e-commerce market And have been there for many, many years. The way they make the majority
of their revenue is not From a sale. They make it from you
continually going back And purchasing over and over again. Now do you use Amazon
or do you use Flipkart? Which one do you use? – I use Amazon most case And Flipkart if there's a good offer. – Okay, so you use Amazon.
– Yeah. – How many times have you
purchased from Amazon? – Almost every other day.
Any need for that matter, Be it even the green tea, Perhaps I have to order
a packet from Amazon. – Okay, so hundreds of times, right? Hundreds of times.
– Hundred, yes. Yes. – So the way they're making
their money is not that You're purchasing once, You're purchasing over and over again. Now in your D2C brand, You're not going to get someone
to purchase hundreds of times Like Amazon.
– Right. – But you can get them to
purchase three times, four times. And it drastically changes your economics On your marketing and your ROI.
It's cheaper to generate more revenue And it's easier to do so
from your existing customers Than it is to go and
acquire new customers. So focus on promotions
for every major holiday, Following up through text
message and email, right? Adding more other ancillary products That you can upsell to your customers. These are all examples
of how you get people To keep purchasing over and
over again over the years. – Fantastic. I love, I totally agree to all the
three points that you have said. Retention marketing is the new tool And everybody's focusing on that. Which tool have you been
using for your clients, For activating omnichannel
marketing, for e-commerce, Or understanding the behavior of buyers And accordingly triggering
content or communication to them? How do you do that? – Yeah, so there's not one tool. You use multiple tools. For email, you can use Mailchimp. For SMS, you can end up
using tools like Minichat, Same with Messenger, you
can use them as well. For SEO, there's a lot of tools out there, Like Uber suggests, for example, One or even Google Search Console. You can, you know, for paid advertising, You're going to want to
use each platform directly For social media management. You could end up using Buffer
or Hootsuite or Sprout Social. The list goes on and on. You're going to end up using
a wide variety of tools To get your omnichannel marketing done. – Awesome.
So, right now in India,
there are tools which Zoho Or Web Engage is trying to bring. And the objective of
these tools are largely To have United Channel
communication strategy Where all the channels are together And the triggers are
happening through these. So do you have some tools like that Which you believe is slowly
picking up like a global trend, Like how Uber suggests is picked up From a search perspective? Do you think any tool from that person, Like how you said
multiple different tools, But is there any one
tool that you recommend? (bell dinging) – Yeah, I haven't seen any one leader. If I had to pick one, it would be HubSpot. They can do the ad features
for every single channel. – Okay. – They're the most well
known and popular one That has been focusing on
omnichannel before anyone else. – Right. Awesome. So Neil, I have seen one thing. I have met so many digital
marketing agency heads And so many digital
marketers and I see them, They're very anxious people. Anxiety or they don't know
how to keep their mind calm. What is your mantra, Neil,
that you would tell them? What is that one thing that you do That you would recommend
them to keep their mind calm? Because this is one of
the most important thing That I believe is a fix that is important In the life of a digital marketer. – So there's like a mantra that I go by And I believe, right?
When things are going really well for you, There's always someone else out there Who has it better than you. When things are going really bad for you, There's always someone out there Who has it much worse than you. Now on both ends, It's very important
because what happens is When things start going
well, people get too excited, They get caught up in the emotions And they lift their foot off the gas pedal And they don't think as clearly. They're on a high and they
think they're invincible And nothing can affect us. On the flip side, when things going down, They're like, it's
doomsday, end of the world. Everything is over. Life is over as we know it
and neither are actually true. You want to say very level-headed So that way you can make
clear precise decisions. – Right. That's a very good thought, Neil, there. Neil, A lot of these young folks are trying To become digital marketer. They get into digital marketing, Trying to get their hands
dirty on everything possible. Let's say, they do SEO for a year And then they want to do
Google ads the second year, Then they want to enter into Facebook ads. Now what do you think, how
important it is for someone To specialize in one of these And become master of that one subject? Because a lot of people are uncertain.
They think that the
industry, I need to be, They don't know, okay, If I see is going to
really be there 10 years Down the line or Google
Ads is going to be there, 10 years down the line, They want to learn everything possible. And sometimes, I feel that
that becomes a challenge In itself because they
become jack of all trades And master of none. What is your take on that?
– Yeah. It's better to be a
master of one than it is To be a jack of all trades. Because right now, when marketing
people are hiring people Who can specialize. So even though a company knows
that you need omnichannel, They're going to hire people
to end up focusing on each And every single channel
individually as they scale up And grow because that's how
you get the best results. – Right. So how many years do you
think a person should give To one industry before he shifts To another in digital marketing. – Industry or channel. – Let's say, somebody is doing SEO Or somebody's doing Facebook ads And he specialize in Facebook ads. So how many years do you– – You just keep going as long as possible. So if you're doing Facebook ads, Eventually, you want to expand
into all forms of paid ads On social media and even
let's say, maybe Google. But you would want to first
conquer all the paid social ads. If you're doing SEO, eventually, You want to figure out OnPage
SEO link building content.
So it starts expanding here and there. But generally speaking, You want to keep going more in depth To all the other areas of marketing That affect your main concentration. Like content effects, SEO. If you're doing paid social on Facebook, You need to learn Instagram too. You need to learn YouTube, You need to learn TikTok.
And the list goes on and on. – Awesome. Some amazing thoughts up there. A lot of digital marketers
are trying to do everything On their own, Like they just, Because there are many
people becoming freelancers, How important it is to delegate. Delegation in the field of
digital marketing to scale up. What is your thought there
and what is the advice That you would like to give to people? – Delegation is super important.
If you don't delegate, Eventually you won't be able to scale. When you delegate, you
want to delegate to people Who are better than you
at that specific task. If you're not delegating to
people who are better than you, Then you're not doing the best
job when it comes to hiring. See, if you had to teach
someone how to do the job, You're hiring the wrong people. – Right. I totally agree. – The the key with delegation is You delegate to people
who make it better than How you would've made it.
– Right. – In essence, they're improving. – I agree. – That's the key to being a great leader.
You hire people who are better than you. – You hire people who are better than you. That's a perfect advice there. And I think it just changes a lot. I started doing that last
four years and just helps you Because you don't have
to be involved much. I believe, Neil, digital marketing is a life skill More than just a marketing skill anymore. Considering after pandemic,
it has become more of survival For many of them. And in fact, even for
many business owners. What's your take? Do you think digital marketing is like A must have life skill today?
What's your take on that? – No, I don't think it's
a must-have life skill. You can hire, there's tons of
digital marketers out there. I think you need to do digital
marketing in your business. If it's a career path. You
don't have to be a marketer. UX and design is just as important, Or copywriting is just as important Or engineering is just as important. I wouldn't say one
profession is more important Than the other. It's more so you should do what you love And you're passionate about. Because if you do what you love
and you're passionate about, You're more likely to succeed at it Because you're going to put in
the time and effort and energy. – Right. I totally agree. Okay, Neil, Since you study a lot about The global digital marketing trends, Which country do you see is
evolving in digital right now
And where do you think India is heading, According to your observation Or analysis that you have possibly done? – So we see the majority
of the countries evolving In digital, and I'll give
you a prime example of this. In America now, you can
end up getting fridges With monitors that are
connected to the internet. So think about your fridge actually having A computer built in. Eventually, the fridge
will order food for you And it'll have it delivered. It's not there yet, but
it's where it's headed. Even in India, Look at the boom that's happened
in digital marketing over The last, you know, few years alone. It's drastically changed. The amount of big companies Coming out of India is ridiculous. There's so many now. And yeah, there's so much potential. I look at India as one of
the fastest growing markets. That has massive potential. And the easy way to see this is, Look where venture
capital dollars are going. If you see where venture
capital dollars are going, India, China, United States, A lot of parts of Latin America, But it's going around the whole globe. But if you see Where the majority of venture
capital dollars are going, Those are the countries that
have a ton of opportunity Right now that are just skewing. – Awesome. So if you're
listening to us right now, Let us know in the comment,
which country are you from.
Neil. Do you learn digital
marketing every single day? If yes, what are your top resources? Where do you learn from? What do you read? – Yeah, so I don't learn
digital marketing each And every single day. I learn it probably once
every two to three days. I continually read blogs from Backlinko To Search Engine Land to
Moz. The list goes on and on. The same ones that you would see. But I learned more actually
by studying other players Within my industry and other
players outside of my industry That are doing unique marketing tactics. So for example, just
watching TV, I settle, I see a lot of D2C e-commerce ads. When I see those ads, a lot of times I'll check out their
site, what they're doing, Their Facebook ad library And see what kind of
campaigns they're running. But I learned by just looking
at people in different spaces. Now I don't own a D2C e-commerce company, I own an ad agency,
NPDigital, and we're global. We're in India, We're in different parts of the world And I learn by looking at other players In different industries. So I don't just look at,
let's say, other ad agencies. I look at e-commerce companies, Other service-based companies. I look at, maybe, accounting
company or a trash company. And you can learn on How all these companies
are doing marketing And see if they're
applicable to your industry. (bell dinging)
– Nice. Some good thoughts there. Okay, Neil, How do you define a life
cycle of a digital marketer, Personally and professionally? – So they're very similar,
personally and professionally. You just go through different stages From learning about marketing, Picking a field that you want
to specialize in, mastering it. Then eventually, you'll
expand into more areas Like a SEO, may expand into content, And then it pretty much
starts all over again. Because once you start in content, You're learning to master and
it keeps rinse and repeating. But here's the big thing That people mess up in
the whole life cycle. It's not how you perceive the life cycle. People mess up because
after they master one thing, They stop. They don't continue try to learn more And improve themselves. And that's the demise of
your career or your future. The moment you stop learning, The moment you think you know enough, Is the moment that someone's
going to eventually overtake you. Whether it's a competitor or
someone else in your space Or that role you're trying to get. You got to keep learning. Never assume that you know everything. You can always be better.
You can always learn more. Even if someone is young and
they're starting their career, You can always learn from them as well. – That's nice. Let me ask you
a personal question, Neil. How spiritual are you as a person? – I'm not too spiritual.
– Cool. I love you're all that. Amazing. What are those three things you
look when you hire a talent? I've asked this this before too, But I always ask this because
there's always something new From you when you answer this question. – So when I look to hire
people, I look for a few things. One, do they work for other people In my industry like
competitors in the past. – Right.
– If they did great. Two, did they work there for a while? Because if they worked there for a while, That means they're usually loyal. You want people who are loyal. Three, did they get
promoted within that job At your competitors? Because if they got promoted, That means someone saw them as valuable. See, when you interview
people, they're always saying, "I did this. I'm the one
who drove these results. I was the best person." You don't know if that's true or not, There's no way for you to really find out. But if they continually got
promoted within that company, That means a company found invaluable And they were doing a good job. And if they worked at a
few of your competitors And they got promoted
in both those companies Multiple times, That means both those companies
found them very valuable. The chances are if you hire them, You'll find them valuable as well. Then I look forward when
you're interviewing them
Because they teach you new things. If they can teach you new things, That's a great sign. Then I also look for if
they're a player or coach. I don't want to hire people
who are just managers. I also want to hire people who can execute And get their hands dirty. And last but not least, I want to make sure
they're a cultural fit. If they're not a cultural fit, They're not going to last
or do well in the company. – That's true. What if you
don't find them cultural effect? You hire them.
– Don't hire them. – No, no, if you hired them And then you realize
they're not cultural fit, What do you do? – You get rid of them, you fire them. Sadly. But it's true. You shouldn't have hired
them in the first place. – That's true. I think that's a very
important decision to take That when they're not cultural fit, Then you should fire them quickly. But what I really love
is for a lot of people, They think when they join
a digital marketing agency, Many millennials out there, They jump from one agency to another Or they just stay in an agency for a year. But what people look forward to When they're hiring you
is how loyal are you And how much growth have you shown inside In that particular role in
that particular company. And that's very important. Some really key takeaways
from the master himself.
Neil, what's your favorite dish And what are you making
this morning in breakfast? – So I don't eat breakfast.
I usually skip it And I will eat lunch. My favorite dish to eat for
breakfast or just in general? – Just in general. – Garlic Nan, it's not really a dish, But it's my favorite food. – Garlic Nan with what?
Chicken, butter chicken? – It can be butter chicken or anything. I just love garlic Nan.
I can eat it all day. – Okay. And you said you skipped your breakfast Because you're doing intermittent fasting. – Correct. So I eat from 12 to 6. – 12 to 6. And as much as
you can or just, how is it? – No, I just eat lunch and dinner. So two meals. – And you don't hit gym is
what you told me last night? – No, I don't hit the gym, But I work out at home every morning. – Awesome. – I do high intensity interval training. – So what are your values
that you truly focus on? This was one of the
most important questions Which I've missed. What are your values
that you truly focus on? – Values in what aspect?
Business, personal life, What aspect? – Let's say professionally, The values that you put
across as the first thing, Whatever, values are values. So it can be personal and professional. – Yeah.
– Yeah.
– So, I'll always treat
other people with respect. Doesn't matter. Personal, professional, If you're not treating
people with respect, Doesn't matter who they are,
what color their skin is, If they're male, female or
whatever gender they may be. Or you know, you just got to
treat people with respect. It's, you know, it's a shitty thing To treat other people crappy. You wouldn't want that to happen to you. Two. Always be ethical. You know, a lot of people
will do what benefits them And they won't be ethical. And it's like, if something's not ethical, Just don't do it. You know? Three, always think long term. A lot of people are very
shortsighted in business And even with their
personal life decisions, You got to think very, very long term. I think that's how you do
extremely well in the long run. The next thing that I
would tell people is, look, No matter what you're doing in life, Whether it's personal or professional, You got to love what you're doing. What's the point of
doing something in life If you don't love it, life is short. Everyone says, "Oh, you got to do stuff
that makes you the most money Or whatnot." Cut back on your expenses. – Right. – It's okay spending less money. It's better to do what
you love than just doing What makes you money. – Right. Some good thoughts then.
How much time do you spend on
your phone every single day, Neil? – Oh, that's a lot. I don't know what the time is, But I charge my phone
at least twice a day. – So your screen time is,
at least, six hours a day? – Probably. I know I talk
at least on the phone, If I had a guess, at least, Four or five hours on phone calls. – Yes. Thanks. I thought I'm the only person
who's addicted to my phone. And how do you see future of Instagram? Because you're on Instagram right now. – I think Instagram eventually will be A much bigger platform than
Facebook itself or Meta. It'll be the main platform. It's a much better social
network than Facebook is. I know this the same company, But if you look at what
a lot of people use, It's easier to use on
your phone. Less clutter. It's simplistic. It's a
better way to connect. You get much more engagement,
not just as a marketer, But as an individual. If you're just looking
to connect with people, There's much more engagement on Instagram That we're seeing than
you can get on Facebook. – Right. Neil, is there a discipline to follow With respect to your personal brand, What it is that you have
been doing consistently, Regardless of what. – So you're saying is there a discipline That I followed to grow my personal brand? Is that what you're asking?
– Yes.
Yes. – Do it for a long
time. Keep giving value, But you can't achieve it
within one year or two years, Three years, five years. You got to think 10 plus year
horizon. And most people don't. But that's how you win. You just think very long
term, keep giving value. No one's going to evangelize
you and follow you over What they hear just on one
video or one live stream. But if you continually help people out And you do what's best for others And you genuinely care to help people. In the long run, you'll
build your personal brand. – Wow, good. And last question of the evening. What is the one thing you don't like About digital marketing industry? – The one thing I don't like, But I can't change is the
platforms have so much control. – Sure. They just change overnight, right? – Yeah. They can change overnight And they can crush so many businesses. And what I mean by this is like I've seen, You know, like a single mother, you know, Have a business and be able
to provide for a family Because of Facebook And then Facebook charter
changes her algorithm And then she can't pay her
rent the next few months And then she's in trouble, right? And it kind of sucks. – Right. It's so very good thought actually. I sometimes feel that they're just,
We're just manipulated by these platforms Every other day and they
control our thoughts. We just don't know when
things may just change. All right, Neil, This was a great 34
minute session with you. I have to tell this that
there's always so much to learn. So when I sent a message to Neil That we are doing this session, So Neil replied, "Yes, let's do it." And yesterday I said,
"Neil, topic is going to be A little intense and I'm
going to send you questions." Neil said, "I don't need questions. It's a live session, let's keep it live." So this is just not scripted.
(bell dinging) He just doesn't know what
questions are coming next. But I like the promptness And you just answer it
with so much of insight. It shows the amount of
experience that you have. It's always pleasure
connecting with you, Neil. It's always pleasure learning from you. Thank you for taking your time out And lots of love to your
children and to your family. Have a great day today. – You too. And thank you very much for doing this And for everyone who
takes the time to attend. Really appreciate you guys taking the time Out of your busy day. I know
you guys didn't have to be here, So we both appreciate that as well.
